carl, Carl Lentz, celebrity, celebrity pastor, Chris Rosebrough, Fighting For The Faith, hillson, Hillsong Church, Lentz, Rosebrough
Carl Lentz: Image vs Substance
from Chris Rosebrough PLUS 1 day ago ALL AUDIENCES
Episode 1 of the Fighting for the Faith video blog. This episode deals with Carl Lentz and the bigger problem of image vs. substance in the celebrity pastor culture of much of the Body of Christ.
For more information about Brian Houston’s bible twisting & the Word of Faith Heresy, click this link bit.ly/1gAQ1Zz
For more and deeper information about good Christology, click this link bit.ly/1bKD8XO
Source: From vimeo.com/83440952, Carl Lentz: Image vs Substance, Accessed 06/01/2014.
I have been a Christian since 1997 and I have never been so in love and on fire for The Lord like I am today. It’s because of the community and family of Hillsong I have to thank for it! You should see the amount of people I’ve seen come to know Jesus. Friends lives I’ve seen change because of Gods grace. People being healed! Real revival happening in my own life! Please, instead of critising what God is doing through Hillsong church , pray and be thankful for the hundreds of people that are getting saved daily and the thousands who are committed to following Jesus. Ultimately it’s all about Him.
If Hillsong is about Jesus, then why is Hillsong infamous of desecrating the name of Jesus by twisting his word and preaching a different gospel?
I’ve heard Carl Lentz preach, it is very evident that this man loves The Lord. All he talks about is Jesus and pointing people to Him. Sad that this Chris Rosebrough has chosen to use his platform to cut down other Christians instead of the love of God. No wonder people don’t want to become Christians, all we do is fight with each other. John 13:35
I’ve only heard Carl lentz preach in person once, but I still remember how powerful that service was. He preached on the love of the father, and understanding the grace of God and getting freed from shame. So awesome you features him on your blog! If I had one suggestion, it would be that you highlight what God is doing in your life instead of always putting all the focus on preachers and churches. It becomes unhealthy when you spend all your time focusing on what this or that pastor said when God is trying to speak to you!
The purpose of our sites is to monitor the dangerous teachings, practices and movements of these international Word of Faith cults, not our own personal experiences and revelations. Christians do not realise that Hillsong preach a different Jesus and a different faith.
They cannot know or preach love if their ‘love’ is not founded on the essential doctrines of the Christian faith.
You are right. Pastor Carl’s teaching is dangerous. It is dangerous to the oppression of sin in the lives of thousands.
To say that Pastor Carl does not preach Biblical ‘love’ is extremely presumptuous. To say one cannot know “love” without essential doctrines of the Christian faith is a stretch. There are millions of people that know a form of love that are not followers of Christ. The key difference is that they do not understand the magnitude of the selfless love that Christ poured out for us upon the cross. An un-believer’s understanding of love is bound to be limited. But Pastor Carl preaches of a Christ like love. He abides by the love of Christ that I agree is founded on the essential doctrines of the Christian faith. Watch a few of his full sermons from beginning to end then make up your mind for yourself (“problem called praise” and “scandal called grace” are two good examples. Use google) . Remember that Rosebrough is also human. Be cynical of both he and Lentz and prayerfully develop your own position.
As far as Mr. Rosebrough is concerned. Anyone who is so presumptuous as to assume Mr. Lentz spends “considerable money” on his haircut and style and is therefore unqualified to pastor must look themselves in the mirror. Rosebrough claims without a reason of a doubt at 13:25 that Lentz spends too much time and money on his image. Never in my life have I heard a more appearance based judgmental statement then that. Would a true “pastor” show up to do a tv interview in sweats and a tee? Only then would we know for certain that he dedicates the Biblical amount of time and money to his appearance (sarcasm).
At times I feel Rosebrough is far more passionate about what he stands against than what he actually stands FOR. He comes across so full of resentment, destain and theological arrogance that it is difficult decipher the loving nature of his critique.
Understanding that I disagree with some of Lentz’ approaches, I have also been inspired by his passion for the Lord. I mean, I have been lit ablaze with a hunger for greater passion for Christ. Understand that he (Lentz) is a young man on his own journey with Christ. Lentz is the first one to admit his imperfections and inadequacies. In contrast, Rosebrough is sure to point out numerous times in the video that HE will be the one to reveal false teachings. That HE has the answers. That HIS interpretation of scripture is the right one.
Friends, remain in tune with the Holy Spirit. Remain in prayer and in the Word. Do not rely on Lentz or Rosebrough for truth. As believers the Word is alive in us through the Holy Spirit. Let THAT be your discernment. Let the Holy Spirit be the one to reveal false teachings. NOT a middle-aged self-proclaimed theologian with a radio show claiming to be judge and jury.
It is easy to prey on the words of pastors on the front lines of ministry. Rosebrough is a modern day pharisee pouncing on low-hanging fruit. Should we be cynical of pastors like Letnz or Houston? Absolutely. Never stop asking the tough questions. If the words of Letnz or Houston have inspired you and set a fire in your heart for Christ then do not be discouraged!! God has done and continues to do great things through broken people including men like Lentz. Moses, Solomon and David were broken and full of sin yet God chose to build his eternal Kingdom through that lineage. God is doing AMAZING things through the ministry of Hillsong despite its flaws and shortcomings. Thats how GOOD of a God we worship. That even when the church organization occasionally fails, or is led astray, HE is able to do immeasurably more.
You missed the point of Chris Rosebrough’s talk. He was tackling the issue of celebrity pastor. There is difference between someone looking presentable on camera to Carl considering to the minor detail the types of clothes and hair style he wants. It was evident that he came on the show to address his image and the Hillsong image. Sadly, the cost of him focusing on the outward appearance was his horrible resperesentation of the God he says he loves with all his heart.
Lentz proved once again to be uneducated and unreliable to represent the Christian faith. It is sad Lentz faithfully hold to the cultic word of faith doctrines at the expense of the biblical gospel (if he even knows what it is).
Your Gospel has become your Law. And you will not be saved by Law.
Chris Rosebrough claimed this week that Hillsong NYC is part of a ‘multi-campus’ Hillsong and that Brian Houston is the ‘teaching pastor’ via video link from Sydney, and that Carl Lentz rarely preaches. Which is absolutely false. Lentz is the main preacher at Hillsong NYC, and preaches most Sundays. Brian Houston via video only occurs a couple of times a year when Houston delivers his vision etc. Sometimes Rosebrough lets his thundering right-wing radio act get in the way of the facts.
And Rosebrough played part of the interview Tanya Levin did with Andrew Denton back in the mid-2000s. Rosebrough, with very little knowledge of Levin, praised her for her stance against Hillsong. He made no effort to do any research about her, so wasn’t sure is she is still a Christian or not. A quick Google search will tell anyone that Levin is now a rabid atheist who takes every opportunity to put the boot into Hillsong and Christianity in general (particularly on those trash television programs Today Tonight and A Current Affair).
He knows she’s an atheist Newtaste, stay tuned for more. In the meantime enjoy a little Word of Faith Heresy from Carl Lentz.
“Carl Lentz Teaches Word of Faith Heresy at Youth Conference”
Your invisible actions on the other thread are not surprising. You’re a bit like Mark Driscoll. When someone points out your errors you just hide and pretend that nothing had happened … which is in direct contrast to you pointing out the faults in others.
Brock Boot said:
I would have to disagree with you about missing the point of the video. I fully understand the argument that you and Rosebrough are trying to make about appearance. You simply do not agree with my position on it. Thats okay.
Answer me please. How do you KNOW how much time or money Lentz spends on his look? What made it “evident” he came on the show just to address his image? Katy was the one who pointed out his appearance. Not him. Go back and look at pictures of Carl before he became a “celebrity”. Before Hillsong NYC existed. He has always had his own unique style. I find it ironic that YOU and Mr Rosebrough are the only ones actually “focusing on the outward appearance”. Take a look at John 7:24, “do not judge according to appearance but judge with righteous judgement”.
Again, my previous comment was filled with discussion on the deeper issues (love, discernment, the goodness of the Lord) and your reply focused only on the image aspect. You are not engaging in a dialogue on this matter. His image is only truly an issue for those who are so focused on appearance that it is a roadblock to them seeing the heart. You are making statements about Lentz’ heart based on an 5 minute television interview.
Friends, if you dedicated the time to watch Rosebrough’s video, take the time to watch the link I have included in this comment. It is an actual pastor (not a radio personality) addressing the exact same interview Lentz did. He actually disagrees with Letnz. But his analysis is far more mature and Christ centred than the finger pointing Rosebrough does.
Brock Boot said:
And for the record this was directed towards churchwatcher not newtaste. It wouldnt let me reply directly to churchwatchers response to my initial comment.
I am not a Hillsong member, but I do enjoy Carl Lentz’s messages and have found them inspiring. Ironically, I found this by googling more information about Lentz. I started to watch this and give this the benefit of the doubt, but honestly, I had to stop after the first point. It just seemed like you were criticizing him for being well dressed and going on a talk show and I figured that if this was your first point, then the whole argument was probably not going to hold much water. You come across as critical and legalistic, and while I’m sorry you disagree with Lentz, there was nothing in what I saw in this blog to lead me to come back and look into your point of view. The greatest thing is love, and no love for anything is seen on this blog.
“The greatest thing is love, and no love for anything is seen on this blog.”
And Carl Lentz failed to show it in the interview.
Please watch it again. If you think Chris was “criticizing him for being well dressed and going on a talk show”, then you missed the point of what he was talking about.
If you watched the entire thing, Chris does analyse the bad things Carl Lentz said in this interview
@ Brock Boot – interesting comments you’ve made above.
May I suggest you might likewise make a public apology (via YouTube) to Chris Rosebrough for calling him a ” modern day pharisee pouncing on low-hanging fruit”?
A few facts. Saiko Woods is friends with Chris Rosebrough. Do you really think Saiko would call Chris a pharisee?
Chris’ presentation and love of the gospel is wonderful to hear and often presented via FFTF and I’m sure, though Reformed friend Saiko is not Lutheran, he would agree wholeheartedly. And Chris has recently publically asked forgiveness of two other friends of mine, I have a great respect for him and have since I started listening to FFTF in 2007 after 22 years of “charismania”.
Your defense of Carl Lentz might be admirable if you’re a proponent of WOF theology as Carl Lentz has proven to be and that theology was biblical (and it’s not is it?)
“Carl Lentz Teaches Word of Faith Heresy at Youth Conference”
http://www.fightingforthefaith.com/2014/01/patricia-king-barbie-breathitt-talk-symbols-omens.html “Carl Lentz Teaches Word of Faith Heresy at Youth Conference”
I’m friends with Saiko Woods too, for quite a while, and followed the whole twitter discussion from the start, this during a time when people were “apologizing” all over the place recently i.e. Janet Mefferd for confronting Mark Driscoll’s now admitted plagiarism.
It’s interesting times we live in, when believers cannot confront error in the church.
Perhaps we could get a sermon “cage-fight” organized between Carl Lentz and Cory Klein, hearing how they would represent Matthew 20:1–16? Let’s hear the gospel from Carl, one that brings law and gospel, the two parts of the Word of God as a means of grace.
“For the kingdom of heaven is like a master of a house who went out early in the morning to hire laborers for his vineyard. 2 After agreeing with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard. 3 And going out about the third hour………..”
First in the ring? Cory Klein. And the winner is?
I guess we have to find a sermon somewhere with Carl Lentz (re)presenting his side?